Alcohol or steroids? Which is worse?

[Deleted member 21405]

I know a simple search will find hundreds of websites on the topic and maybe there is a thread or two here on the subject, but it's on my mind this morning.

I have a buddy that used to lift with me and actually got in very nice shape completely natty. Fast forward a few years he's not a slob and has been drinking everyday for years. He works second shift and when he gets home starts drinking and then sleeps til he needs to get ready for work day in, day out. We were actually out once about a year ago and he started vomiting on the side walk which had blood in it and he couldn't breathe so I called an ambulance. Still hasn't shared what the hospital said.

He's tripled in size, his face looks completely different, lost all his hair and just looks terrible. His wife was making jokes about how his dick goes soft or doesn't get hard most of the time when they're trying to have sex.

So it got me thinking and I mentioned may he should talk to his doctor about getting his T checked. Instantly he lashes out about how he's not doing that because he has a bad heart. Apparently a minor murmur from childhood. So I dropped the subject.

So he's a drunk and falling apart and sees no issue with it, but thinks a medication to improve his quality of life is going to kill him..

So SST, what do you think is worse for you? Alcohol or steroids?

 

[psauce]

Not all steroids share the same safety profile, so it’s a bit awkward to lump them together, but with a very few exceptions, steroids are safer. I don’t think it’s even all that close — alcohol is one of the single most destructive drugs on the planet, if not THE most.

The harm of a drug is a pretty complicated question, which speaks to the complexity of human chemical biology and behavior. Is it inherently toxic or is the harm from destructive or dangerous behavior? Does it have a high chance of killing you in a single exposure or does it lead health problems with chronic use? Is it more harmful to the person who uses it or the people around them?

Interestingly, for all of these, alcohol is a huge fucking yes. You can get alcohol poisoning from one binge AND it will wreck your liver, kidneys, pancreas, and heart over time. It is toxic itself AND leads to destructive behavior. It will ruin your life and harm people around you.

If you’re into this sort of thing, some researchers in medicine and public health put together a framework for assessing drug harms that includes all the factors they could think of and then asked experts to score drugs on these metrics. This link should take you to a freely available copy of the paper.

Alcohol is #1 and it’s not even close, though that may be different all these years later. Anabolic steroids are on the long tail at the bottom. Further, a number of the personal health harms can be easily mediated with some basic harm reduction, so one can reduce the scored harm associated with AAS. It’s like me vs. Bumstead… one is just a shadow of the other. Not even in the same conversation.

 

[BINGBONG]

Man this is so common with people I grew up with. Everyone turned to alcohol, got married to someone who supports their alcohol use, and let themselves go immediately. Amazing the damage alcohol can do.

It's so hard to tell an alcoholic that he's got a problem. They will never listen until something really bad happens. And then they will start to lie to u about their consumption. Unless it's one of ur absolute best friends, let them destroy themselves. Sounds crude and cruel, but they will not listen and u will waste so much energy trying to help a lost cause.

Now if it's one of ur best friends, different story. I'd be at his house dumping all the booze in front of him dragging his ass to the gym calling him out on how he's turning into a bag of shit. As far as the T goes, I can almost bet within a couple months of quitting alcohol his levels will rebound to an acceptable level.

 

[Deleted member 21405]

Not all steroids share the same safety profile, so it’s a bit awkward to lump them together, but with a very few exceptions, steroids are safer. I don’t think it’s even all that close — alcohol is one of the single most destructive drugs on the planet, if not THE most.

The harm of a drug is a pretty complicated question, which speaks to the complexity of human chemical biology and behavior. Is it inherently toxic or is the harm from destructive or dangerous behavior? Does it have a high chance of killing you in a single exposure or does it lead health problems with chronic use? Is it more harmful to the person who uses it or the people around them?

Interestingly, for all of these, alcohol is a huge fucking yes. You can get alcohol poisoning from one binge AND it will wreck your liver, kidneys, pancreas, and heart over time. It is toxic itself AND leads to destructive behavior. It will ruin your life and harm people around you.

If you’re into this sort of thing, some researchers in medicine and public health put together a framework for assessing drug harms that includes all the factors they could think of and then asked experts to score drugs on these metrics. This link should take you to a freely available copy of the paper.

Alcohol is #1 and it’s not even close, though that may be different all these years later. Anabolic steroids are on the long tail at the bottom. Further, a number of the personal health harms can be easily mediated with some basic harm reduction, so one can reduce the scored harm associated with AAS. It’s like me vs. Bumstead… one is just a shadow of the other. Not even in the same conversation.

What a great reply. Thank you for this response. I didn't mean lump them all together I know some are worse than others in regards to AAS, but more a broad question. I love this info. If only he wasn't so hard headed he could actually understand he's killing himself

 

[Deleted member 21405]

Man this is so common with people I grew up with. Everyone turned to alcohol, got married to someone who supports their alcohol use, and let themselves go immediately. Amazing the damage alcohol can do.

It's so hard to tell an alcoholic that he's got a problem. They will never listen until something really bad happens. And then they will start to lie to u about their consumption. Unless it's one of ur absolute best friends, let them destroy themselves. Sounds crude and cruel, but they will not listen and u will waste so much energy trying to help a lost cause.

Now if it's one of ur best friends, different story. I'd be at his house dumping all the booze in front of him dragging his ass to the gym calling him out on how he's turning into a bag of shit. As far as the T goes, I can almost bet within a couple months of quitting alcohol his levels will rebound to an acceptable level.

He used to be my best. We have definitely grown apart with our different paths. I drink maybe twice a year and his idea of hanging out is I sit and watch him and his lady fight while he's getting hammered. So it definitely got old.

Thanks for the reply. It really is amazing in just a short period of time what a physical difference this has made in his life. He was lean, muscular, fun to be around. Now he's awful looking and his attitude is awful. It's weird too because he's actually four years younger than me and I just turned 37. He looks late 40s

 

[Deleted member 21405]

Not all steroids share the same safety profile, so it’s a bit awkward to lump them together, but with a very few exceptions, steroids are safer. I don’t think it’s even all that close — alcohol is one of the single most destructive drugs on the planet, if not THE most.

The harm of a drug is a pretty complicated question, which speaks to the complexity of human chemical biology and behavior. Is it inherently toxic or is the harm from destructive or dangerous behavior? Does it have a high chance of killing you in a single exposure or does it lead health problems with chronic use? Is it more harmful to the person who uses it or the people around them?

Interestingly, for all of these, alcohol is a huge fucking yes. You can get alcohol poisoning from one binge AND it will wreck your liver, kidneys, pancreas, and heart over time. It is toxic itself AND leads to destructive behavior. It will ruin your life and harm people around you.

If you’re into this sort of thing, some researchers in medicine and public health put together a framework for assessing drug harms that includes all the factors they could think of and then asked experts to score drugs on these metrics. This link should take you to a freely available copy of the paper.

Alcohol is #1 and it’s not even close, though that may be different all these years later. Anabolic steroids are on the long tail at the bottom. Further, a number of the personal health harms can be easily mediated with some basic harm reduction, so one can reduce the scored harm associated with AAS. It’s like me vs. Bumstead… one is just a shadow of the other. Not even in the same conversation.

Just skimmed article. That graph is mind-blowing just how terrible alcohol is. It's worse than heroine lol

 

[CaffeineandKilos]

Well alcohol in even very small amounts is incredibly bad for you. The old days of doctors telling it's ok to have a glass of wine every day are over folks. AFib, cancer, shit, alcohol literally damages DNA, and then inhibits your bodies ability to repair it.

SOME steroids may be more immediately dangerous than alcohol. But long term? Nah alcohol is worse

 

[psauce]

An interesting property about alcohol is that it is toxic to every tissue and organ in the body. It is unique among drugs in that sense. A lot of them are bad in one way or another, and neutral or even beneficial in some small way. However, there's no part of the body that isn't directly harmed by ethanol.

I'm not anti-alcohol, and drank enough to kill all of Escobar's hippos for periods of my life, but people even if you love it, you gotta acknowledge the basic facts. Its effects may be really pleasant, but they come with a hefty price tag.

 

[Deleted member 21405]

An interesting property about alcohol is that it is toxic to every tissue and organ in the body. It is unique among drugs in that sense. A lot of them are bad in one way or another, and neutral or even beneficial in some small way. However, there's no part of the body that isn't directly harmed by ethanol.

I'm not anti-alcohol, and drank enough to kill all of Escobar's hippos for periods of my life, but people even if you love it, you gotta acknowledge the basic facts. Its effects may be really pleasant, but they come with a hefty price tag.

You're right. It's so normal and something people can't wait to go do on a weekend. It's def fun to try to go bang chicks from a bar, but shit you're just killing yourself

 

[cooper18dunn]

I know a simple search will find hundreds of websites on the topic and maybe there is a thread or two here on the subject, but it's on my mind this morning.

I have a buddy that used to lift with me and actually got in very nice shape completely natty. Fast forward a few years he's not a slob and has been drinking everyday for years. He works second shift and when he gets home starts drinking and then sleeps til he needs to get ready for work day in, day out. We were actually out once about a year ago and he started vomiting on the side walk which had blood in it and he couldn't breathe so I called an ambulance. Still hasn't shared what the hospital said.

He's tripled in size, his face looks completely different, lost all his hair and just looks terrible. His wife was making jokes about how his dick goes soft or doesn't get hard most of the time when they're trying to have sex.

So it got me thinking and I mentioned may he should talk to his doctor about getting his T checked. Instantly he lashes out about how he's not doing that because he has a bad heart. Apparently a minor murmur from childhood. So I dropped the subject.

So he's a drunk and falling apart and sees no issue with it, but thinks a medication to improve his quality of life is going to kill him..

So SST, what do you think is worse for you? Alcohol or steroids?

Your friend is most likely an alcoholic. Drinking everyday is a good sign that he is.
If he's a good friend what you should actually is to get him to detox, meaning Medical detox, and do a 30-day in-house program where he could really dry out and get perspective. I know I've been there. It doesn't need testosterone, he needs help.

 

[Deleted member 21405]

Your friend is most likely an alcoholic. Drinking everyday is a good sign that he is.
If he's a good friend what you should actually is to get him to detox, meaning Medical detox, and do a 30-day in-house program where he could really dry out and get perspective. I know I've been there. It doesn't need testosterone, he needs help.

Wasn't a push to get him on gear. Just the way he's describing things about himself like this ED etc I mentioned it.

Also, his wife is a drunk as well. He's not gonna listen to me. Point of post was his comments in health got me thinking because clearly gea destroying his and thinks because is legal it's fine and safe

 

[PteRoy]

It's an interesting topic. My parents have been alcoholics for geez almost 40 years now. This is daily drinking and getting drunk on days they don't work for reference. Could I, or anyone, abuse anabolic steroids for 40+ years? What would my health be vs my parents health? I don't know, but my guess would be I wouldn't make it that long. Short term, I don't think there is much of a debate outside of someone having an underlying health issue or just being an idiot.

 

[SteveO]

arnold, sylvester, lou, and a bunch of others would not be alive today if they had been drinkers of booze like they were (are) users of steroids.

 

[mcdykb]

This is how I look at it. Both of em are probably fine in moderation, but if you’re gonna go swimming in the deep end with them, I’d rather the one that at least gets me jacked while I’m fucking myself up

 

[Deleted member 21405]

This is how I look at it. Both of em are probably fine in moderation, but if you’re gonna go swimming in the deep end with them, I’d rather the one that at least gets me jacked while I’m fucking myself up

Solid reply. One just destroys your body, mind and life. I've never known anyone that's completely fucked up their life juicing, but a couple with drinking.