Peptide vials without vacuum?

[feijao1]

Should there be any concern if the vials I am reconstituting are not under vacuum? I have been through tons of vials of many different peptides from many different suppliers and have never had a vial that is not under vacuum.

Thanks

 

[PCT4ME]

Concern? Not much more than any other UGL peptide and the potential risk they represent.

A quality problem? Yes.

The lyophilization process creates vacuum. It's not a separate step that can be accidentally forgotten.

When it's missing it indicates the stopper didn't properly seal the vial.

Maybe a minuscule, very small slow leak that took weeks to lose vacuum. Maybe a big leak. Who knows,

If makes it less likely to be sterile (although according to Jano plenty of peptides are unsterile even with vacuum).

As far as the peptide itself, some can be oxidized when air is present, others can't. When they oxidize, they typically become less effective and unstable, degrading faster than normal, after reconstitution. This damage can't be detected by standard purity testing.

I'd complain to the seller. It's not acceptable.

If you use the vial, filtering it will ensure sterility, and remove a lot of any degraded peptide that's aggregated into larger, inactive molecules that you're better off not injecting. A good practice missing vacuum or not.

If you're curious if a peptide can oxidize, google its amino formula. If it contains Met, Cys, or Trp it can degrade in the presence of oxygen.

 

[lifter6973]

 

[feijao1]

Concern? Not much more than any other UGL peptide and the potential risk they represent.

A quality problem? Yes.

The lyophilization process creates vacuum. It's not a separate step that can be accidentally forgotten.

When it's missing it indicates the stopper didn't properly seal the vial.

Maybe a minuscule, very small slow leak that took weeks to lose vacuum. Maybe a big leak. Who knows,

If makes it less likely to be sterile (although according to Jano plenty of peptides are unsterile even with vacuum).

As far as the peptide itself, some can be oxidize when air is present, others can't. When they oxidize, they typically become less effective and unstable, degrading faster than normal, after reconstitution. This damage can't be detected by standard purity testing.

I'd complain to the seller. It's not acceptable.

If you use the vial, filtering it will ensure sterility, and remove a lot of any degraded peptide that's aggregated into larger, inactive molecules that you're better off not injecting. A good practice missing vacuum or not.

If you're curious if a peptide can oxidize, google its amino formula. If it contains Met, Cys, or Trp it can degrade in the presence of oxygen.

Thank you so much for taking the time to help and giving me some other things to look into! Looking like we are Met, Cys, and Trp free.

Chemical Structure of Retatrutide
The sequence is a 39-amino-acid peptide with modifications for stability and efficacy:

• Sequence: Tyr-Aib-Gln-Gly-Thr-Phe-Thr-Ser-Asp-Tyr-Ser-Ile-αMeLeu-Leu-Asp-Lys-Lys(PEG2-γ-Glu-Eicosanedioic acid)-Ala-Gln-Aib-Ala-Phe-Ile-Glu-Tyr-Leu-Leu-Glu-Gly-Gly-Pro-Ser-Ser-Gly-Ala-Pro-Pro-Pro-Ser-NH2
• Key Components:
  • Standard amino acids: Tyr (Tyrosine), Gln (Glutamine), Gly (Glycine), Thr (Threonine), Phe (Phenylalanine), Ser (Serine), Asp (Aspartic acid), Ile (Isoleucine), Leu (Leucine), Lys (Lysine), Ala (Alanine), Glu (Glutamic acid), Pro (Proline).
  • Non-coded amino acids:
    • Aib: Aminoisobutyric acid (positions 2 and 20), enhances stability by preventing enzymatic degradation.
    • αMeLeu: Alpha-methyl-leucine (position 13), further improves stability.
  • Modification at Lys17: The lysine at position 17 is conjugated to a PEG2-γ-Glu-Eicosanedioic acid linker, which adds a fatty acid chain (eicosanedioic acid) to extend the peptide’s half-life via albumin binding, allowing once-weekly dosing.
  • C-terminal amidation: The peptide ends with an amide group (-NH2), increasing stability and receptor affinity.

 

[PCT4ME]

Thank you so much for taking the time to help and giving me some other things to look into! Looking like we are Met, Cys, and Trp free.

Chemical Structure of Retatrutide
The sequence is a 39-amino-acid peptide with modifications for stability and efficacy:

• Sequence: Tyr-Aib-Gln-Gly-Thr-Phe-Thr-Ser-Asp-Tyr-Ser-Ile-αMeLeu-Leu-Asp-Lys-Lys(PEG2-γ-Glu-Eicosanedioic acid)-Ala-Gln-Aib-Ala-Phe-Ile-Glu-Tyr-Leu-Leu-Glu-Gly-Gly-Pro-Ser-Ser-Gly-Ala-Pro-Pro-Pro-Ser-NH2
• Key Components:
  • Standard amino acids: Tyr (Tyrosine), Gln (Glutamine), Gly (Glycine), Thr (Threonine), Phe (Phenylalanine), Ser (Serine), Asp (Aspartic acid), Ile (Isoleucine), Leu (Leucine), Lys (Lysine), Ala (Alanine), Glu (Glutamic acid), Pro (Proline).
  • Non-coded amino acids:
    • Aib: Aminoisobutyric acid (positions 2 and 20), enhances stability by preventing enzymatic degradation.
    • αMeLeu: Alpha-methyl-leucine (position 13), further improves stability.
  • Modification at Lys17: The lysine at position 17 is conjugated to a PEG2-γ-Glu-Eicosanedioic acid linker, which adds a fatty acid chain (eicosanedioic acid) to extend the peptide’s half-life via albumin binding, allowing once-weekly dosing.
  • C-terminal amidation: The peptide ends with an amide group (-NH2), increasing stability and receptor affinity.

European equivalent of the FDA determined it can be damaged by oxygen. They required that Eli Lily be able to detect it in their testing in case it happens to the raw material.

In the EMA’s public assessment the Committee noted that when the finished product was subjected to oxidative-stress conditions, specific degradation products were formed, proving that tirzepatide is susceptible to oxidation.

https://www.ema.europa.eu/en/documents/assessment-report/mounjaro-epar-public-assessment-report_en.pdf

 

[Sector]

European equivalent of the FDA determined it can be damaged by oxygen. They required that Eli Lily be able to detect it in their testing in case it happens to the raw material.

In the EMA’s public assessment the Committee noted that when the finished product was subjected to oxidative-stress conditions, specific degradation products were formed, proving that tirzepatide is susceptible to oxidation.

https://www.ema.europa.eu/en/documents/assessment-report/mounjaro-epar-public-assessment-report_en.pdf

What extent of degradation are we talking about here? 1-3%? Or is it something more significant like 25-50%?

 

[hexagonal]

What extent of degradation are we talking about here? 1-3%? Or is it something more significant like 25-50%?

I imagine it depends on the amount of air ingress, storage temperature, and total exposure. I'd bet something sitting room temp with constant air exchange for a year is likely to be significantly more fucked than something with a slow leak in a fridge or freezer.

I've had a vial or two of random things lack vacuum and not notice any difference in efficacy or added cloudiness or anything. Didn't think twice about using them. Stored in a -40F freezer for 1-2 months for both.

I'm one of those guys that filters all my stuff anyway since I don't find it particularly bothersome and am willing to do so even for a small chance of it increasing safety, though.

 

[Sector]

I imagine it depends on the amount of air ingress, storage temperature, and total exposure. I'd bet something sitting room temp with constant air exchange for a year is likely to be significantly more fucked than something with a slow leak in a fridge or freezer.

I've had a vial or two of random things lack vacuum and not notice any difference in efficacy or added cloudiness or anything. Didn't think twice about using them. Stored in a -40F freezer for 1-2 months for both.

I'm one of those guys that filters all my stuff anyway since I don't find it particularly bothersome and am willing to do so even for a small chance of it increasing safety, though.

Yeah I just mean since he read the studies I was curious what % of degradation was seen from vacuum less vials, absent other factors like room temperature or exposure to sunlight or other things

Like if you just put it in the fridge and it happened to lack a vacuum, how much % potency loss? Obviously time is a factor but generally speaking

I’ve had vacuumless peptides over the years and never noticed a difference in potency loss either. Not saying it doesn’t have the potential to degrade it, but if it does it seems rather insignificant, I would assume maybe a few % max